Using the Huawei HG612 on Digital Region instead of the Cellpipe

[SpencerUk]

(08-05-2012 04:41 AM)alexatkin Wrote:  No idea, might have been today if it wasn't for the bank holiday.

Just spoke to Henry (I think) at Origin and he seemed somewhat less optimistic about getting this working. He said he would try asking Thales for the settings, but that is far from the impression I had gotten previous which was that they already knew the settings. I must have misunderstood something they said casually about plans for the future and thought it was already in place. I know either Henry or Oliver said they WOULD work something out to enable greater than 100Mbit speeds (which would mean they HAD to replace the Cellpipe) if I were to sync at a speed which required it.

What is puzzling me though is if they don't already know the settings, how else did they test the 120Mbit line reported on the Max page?

Ah well, I will try guessing even if Thales don't tell him anything useful. Perhaps I will get lucky and it being identical to Infinity.

I love the optimism of Origin, but I think its causing some things they said to be misunderstood.

I agree totally with this.

Wouldn't surprise me if Digital Region were looking at new equipment. I personally dislike the cellpipe and the LBO all in one solution.

On a side note, according to notifications, you have sent me an email, I'll get round to responding to it now.

[LeJimster]

This doesn't inspire me with much faith if they don't even know the settings to configure the modems for their own service. Is it a case of Thales keeping their cards too close to their chest? Is it going to require somebody to rip the settings out of the Cellpipe to figure this out? What about the LBO users with the Zyxel? Do they have more access to that router to see what settings are needed for the internet connection, or has that been locked down too?

[alexatkin]

You are forgetting, the Cellpipe was designed to provision different services via different providers. So it makes sense Origin do not know the settings as I could also have VoIP and IPTV as well with completely different providers, and Origin couldn't be expected to know the settings for those.

The whole point is that Thales provision these services on the Cellpipe and all the providers need to know is which port on the Cellpipe you plug into for their service.

The problem with this picture is I have no plan to have anything other than an ISP on my connection, all VoIP and IPTV will be over the ISPs circuit so I want to optimise my connection for an ISP only.

[LeJimster]

I think the real problem is will you get an answer? Hasn't Thales and DR parted ways. I was just re-reading the news release and there won't be somebody to replace them until Autumn. Which begs the question who is picking up the slack in the mean time.

[alexatkin]

As I understand it Thales will continue until their replacement is found. Its not like they can just kick everyone out of NOC and "hope for the best".

[alexatkin]

Well, the HG612 arrived and it does sync (a damn site quicker than the Cellpipe too), but I'm at a loss for how to get any further.

I think I am stuck on the 802.1Q WAN VLAN ID. On the default BT settings of 101 I was not getting any response, by disabling it I am getting packets coming in but still no Internet connectivity.

However as it syncs I can confirm a few things. First and foremost, at LEAST 16ms of my latency IS caused by Thales putting interleaving on my line!

I can also confirm I am going to easily sync over 100Mbit on the Max Trial as apparently Origin were wrong about Thales putting me back to profile 8 to fix the 60ms ping problem, I am still on 17a.

Code:

xdslcmd: ADSL driver and PHY status
Status: Showtime
Retrain Reason: 0
Max:    Upstream rate = 24064 Kbps, Downstream rate = 126768 Kbps
Path:   0, Upstream rate = 10986 Kbps, Downstream rate = 43997 Kbps

Link Power State:       L0
Mode:                   VDSL2 Annex B
VDSL2 Profile:          Profile 17a
TPS-TC:                 PTM Mode
Trellis:                U:OFF /D:ON
Line Status:            No Defect
Training Status:        Showtime
                Down            Up
SNR (dB):        31.1            18.2
Attn(dB):        0.0             0.0
Pwr(dBm):        10.7           -8.4
                        VDSL2 framing
                        Path 0
B:              111             105
M:              1               1
T:              32              17
R:              16              16
S:              0.0810          0.3065
L:              12648           3184                                                                                                                                                                              
D:              397             202                                                                                                                                                                                
I:              128             61                                                                                                                                                                                
N:              128             122                                                                                                                                                                                
                        Counters                                                                                                                                                                                  
                        Path 0                                                                                                                                                                                    
OHF:            518280          129057                                                                                                                                                                            
OHFErr:         0               0                                                                                                                                                                                  
RS:             66339798                371362                                                                                                                                                                    
RSCorr:         0               55                                                                                                                                                                                
RSUnCorr:       0               0                                                                                                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                                                                                                  
                        Path 0                                                                                                                                                                                    
HEC:            0               0
OCD:            0               0
LCD:            0               0
Total Cells:    113971229               0
Data Cells:     9928            0
Drop Cells:     0
Bit Errors:     0               0

ES:             0               1
SES:            0               1
UAS:            169             169
AS:             1345

                        Path 0
INP:            2.00            2.00
PER:            2.59            10.42
delay:          8.00            8.00
OR:             98.81           36.84

Bitswap:        0               0

Discovery Phase (Initial) Band Plan
US: (0,95) (872,1203) (1972,2779)
DS: (32,867) (1208,1963) (2788,3955)
Medley Phase (Final) Band Plan
US: (0,95) (872,1203) (1972,2779)
DS: (32,867) (1208,1963) (2788,3955)
       VDSL Port Details       Upstream        Downstream
Attainable Net Data Rate:      23728 kbps        125656 kbps
Actual Aggregate Tx Power:    -   8.4 dBm          10.7 dBm
============================================================================
  VDSL Band Status        U0      U1      U2      U3      D1      D2      D3
  Line Attenuation(dB):  2.8     16.9    24.3     N/A    8.3     20.7    31.7
Signal Attenuation(dB):  2.5     16.7    23.9     N/A    8.3     20.7    31.7
        SNR Margin(dB):  29.7    18.0    18.0     N/A    31.2    31.1    30.8
         TX Power(dBm): -27.3   -18.6   -9.0      N/A    4.8     4.4     6.2

Its also interesting to see that Thales have compensated for overheads in the sync speeds, unlike BT.

BT Infinity: Upstream rate = 9999 Kbps, Downstream rate = 39999 Kbps
Digital Region: Upstream rate = 10986 Kbps, Downstream rate = 43997 Kbps

So on the 40/10 service you SHOULD be able to attain real-world speeds of 40/10, which my jDast speed test pretty much confirms. It makes it all the more puzzling why its so hard to actually get those speeds in normal use.

[aceado]

wow that is shocking

Path: Upstream rate = 10986 Kbps, Downstream rate = 43997 Kbps Max: Upstream rate = 24064 Kbps, Downstream rate = 126768 Kbps

[alexatkin]

Its going to be slower than that, as Max rate never takes into account the SNRM. But I still suspect it will be over 100Mbit.

That said I doubt its worth worrying about getting the Cellpipe swapped for something with Gigabit ports, as the overheads on VDSL are much higher than plain ethernet. I suspect that a maximum VDSL sync would still only give real world speeds of around 100Mbit. That would also explain why all VDSL router manufacturers claim 100Mbit as the top speed, even the ones with Gigabit ports.

One thing IS for sure though, it will kick Infinitys arse. The maximum sync on BT is 79999 which kinda sucks, if I were them I would cap it at more like 89999 in an attempt to get real world speeds of 80Mbit. That is basically what Thales seem to have done for 40/10 which is unexpected sensible of them, although that was probably more to compensate for the speed lost due to the interleaving.

Based on peoples ping results I think its safe to assume EVERYONE on Digital Region has interleaving applied. At least I can finally confirm that now, I just wish I could actually get online with the HG612 as its a lot smaller than the Cellpipe and the LEDs aren't as annoyingly bright.

[mirdragon]

yeh the bt modem's are nice and small - i've even been looking at the draytek router as i no longer need smoothwall to monitor my connection (and haven't done so for some time) as since leaving dr it's been more stable - it could be like you say and bt assigning lower sync speeds to improve stability but i rather have this than the constant instability i had while on the dr network.

[LeJimster]

@alexatkin good work man! Nice to see these stats and confirm the interleave "issue" that is a totally unnecessary thing for some lines like your own. I presume you are using a unlocked version of the HG612? Have you tried putting it into bridge mode like the cellpipe is? or are there still too many settings to configure for that mode to make it work either.