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Anyone getting squeeky bum time with Digital Region?
24-12-2012, 06:50 PM
Post: #31
RE: Anyone getting squeeky bum time with Digital Region?
I think the point here is not that they don't recognise a provider, its that they don't know about the providers or the provision. DR is not on anyone's radar let alone the providers like Origin.

There has been no competition for DR in terms of 3mb plus broadband in my vicinity for the whole of 2012. This is known as a competitive advantage, an advantage that was not pushed in any real way, and now they are about to lose it...

To me the key question for this stream is why would new investors invest in DR? If there is not a good reason, essentially the potential to make a profit, why would anyone put their dosh into it... So if you were going to 'sell' DR to investors, what is it about the network that has the potential to make it worthwhile investing in it?
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24-12-2012, 07:37 PM
Post: #32
RE: Anyone getting squeeky bum time with Digital Region?
Tbh when I first heard of DR and visited their website I hadn't heard of any of the isp's on the list.
But after contacting my MP about BT's reluctance to upgrade Attercliffe exchange I knew the only way for me to get a better than 2.5mb was to go onto DR,which I did in August with Origin.

BT still ave no plans to upgrade so the choice for me is simple..either stick with DR or move back to snail BB with another non DR isp.

Phil.
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26-12-2012, 12:12 PM
Post: #33
RE: Anyone getting squeeky bum time with Digital Region?
(24-12-2012 06:50 PM)alec1951 Wrote:  I think the point here is not that they don't recognise a provider, its that they don't know about the providers or the provision. DR is not on anyone's radar let alone the providers like Origin.

There has been no competition for DR in terms of 3mb plus broadband in my vicinity for the whole of 2012. This is known as a competitive advantage, an advantage that was not pushed in any real way, and now they are about to lose it...

To me the key question for this stream is why would new investors invest in DR? If there is not a good reason, essentially the potential to make a profit, why would anyone put their dosh into it... So if you were going to 'sell' DR to investors, what is it about the network that has the potential to make it worthwhile investing in it?

I highly suspect there are more people who will "only" consider the big providers (Virgin, BT, TalkTalk, Sky) than we think. The same applies to Telephone, Gas, Electricity, etc. People are under the illusion that bigger companies offer a better deal and are more reliable.

However what does Digital Region offer that makes it better, or even comparable to BT? Now THAT is the question.

When talking to Digital Region myself and even a Thales engineer who worked on the original network build, they talk up the network quite well. Going on about the lack of contention, the precise control over how data is transferred over the network so they can guarantee quality of service and security for sensitive business data like the government. However they are never specific about how that actually translates to the real world.

Its also odd that the topology maps I have seen imply that each exchange only has 1 gigabit of bandwidth, which would be tiny for a exchange full of 70Mbit or even 40Mbit connections, something just doesn't add up. The only answer I ever get from them is "no, we do not have any contention on the network".

Of course this focus on business centric functionality was a huge detriment to the network in its early days, as all the ISPs were business focused and priced accordingly. So it just leaves more questions about what Digital Region is really offering.

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26-12-2012, 04:19 PM
Post: #34
RE: Anyone getting squeeky bum time with Digital Region?
The way I see it is that DR only has a competitive edge when and where there is no other high band width provision, as with Ray_Von and myself. However when the BT box, which seems to be in position already on Acorn Drive, is open for business, DR will no longer have any real advantage in my area for all the reasons laid out above.

In like for like competition with the BT network and its associated providers DR would seem to have only two competitive strategy open to it, which would be to compete on cost. That is that to be competitive it would have to do more for less... Given the way it is set-up can't see it being able to this because to sustain the strategy it would have to be able to essentially force the BT network out of South Yorkshire to get the relevant numbers.

So if DR can't provide bang for bucks competition for BT, it is down to providing a differentiated service. It will have to provide something over and above what people get on the BT network, and I for one have no idea what that differentiate provision could be that could be sold in enough units to make commercial sense.
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26-12-2012, 07:09 PM
Post: #35
RE: Anyone getting squeeky bum time with Digital Region?
It's like the DR cab versus the BT cab in my area - there were only a few users on the DR DSLAM in the DR cab according to Ripwire, before I left and it was mainly because people weren't willing to risk going with an unknown company to provide them with internet. There were also the negative reports about them losing money and the problems with finding a well known ISP on the network. If it was a Virgin cab that went up, then the uptake would have been huge, it would also have been the same if DR had got a big ISP onboard. The problem was they didn't do any market survey in our area to see who would join up.

Before the BT cab went up I received numerous emails and mailshots in the post about Infinity arriving and so did many others and when I moved back to BT in January 2012, the engineer mentioned they had more interest in BT, Sky and TalkTalk Fibre in a few weeks, compared to the amount of interest they got for going with a DR provider.

Next year BT release FTTP if you are on a FTTC, even though it could cost £500+ install fee, now DR laid most of the cable past people's houses (ie mine is less than a foot from my gate) and if they had thought about it they could have looked at providing FTTP from the onset if they created connection nodes outside peoples property. If they done this I think they would have been onto a winner, but as it stands how the network moves forward is anyone's guess, but they have a lot of competition that they could have easily avoided if they done it right in the first place.

Also BT have upgraded most exchanges for multi-casting and also releasing linear channels onto their products

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26-12-2012, 07:28 PM
Post: #36
RE: Anyone getting squeeky bum time with Digital Region?
This is what I would be left with without DR..Sad



BT are now talking about FTTH and 100mb+ connections,yet myself(and many,many users like me)are just being forgotten about.Sad

Phil.
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27-12-2012, 06:09 PM (This post was last modified: 27-12-2012 06:11 PM by clifft.)
Post: #37
RE: Anyone getting squeeky bum time with Digital Region?
There is an edited business case here :

http://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/44...0Paper.pdf

It's very difficult to read sideways. In early 2009 DR looked to be the only show in town, but by the end of 2009 Infinity was about to be launched. I don't understand why the business case wasn't revisited at that time. Assumptions in the report about what BT might do were already looking questionable. Contracts might already have been signed with Thales, but pulling out at that stage would have been much cheaper than ending up with what in reality is a bit of a white elephant and £100m flushed down the toilet. If any organisation has bid to run it, I can only assume that they were bidding for the lowest subsidy (bit like the railways). I've worked on a couple of multi-million pound IT projects where the plug has been pulled in the build phase. The public sector always seem to carry on regardless.
I shall continue to enjoy my Origin service whilst I can, but I don't really want my council tax subsidising it.
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27-12-2012, 06:59 PM
Post: #38
RE: Anyone getting squeeky bum time with Digital Region?
What makes me laugh about the whole thing is that the councils have invested in it themselves, yet also done nothing to promote it properly, but want to use tax-payers money to fund it

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27-12-2012, 08:56 PM
Post: #39
RE: Anyone getting squeeky bum time with Digital Region?
I honestly think that this is BT's for the taking but with them being awarded various other contracts around the country, would they still want Digital Region?
If and its a big IF Digital Region goes to the wall (can't endlessly keep pumping money in), what happens to LittleBigOne and Origin?. As far as I know (may well be very wrong on this!) but their only portfolios is on Digital Region...

@Ray_Von

WBC services should pop up soon for you. Ipstream Connect and Max (Fixed rate and max) are being phased out.

FTTP is too expensive for what it is and most of it is subject to planning anyway from all parties..especially the councils and that can be...interesting...

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Spencer Davies
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27-12-2012, 10:12 PM
Post: #40
RE: Anyone getting squeeky bum time with Digital Region?
Well from what I've read, the entire tender process is to manage the network, not to take over it as the sole ISP. They'll effectively take over most of the roles from Thales and DRL, and maybe bring their own retail brands.. in effect kind of run in a wholesale capacity, so LB1 and Origin won't simply be bounced off the network. Though if BT does win, and it brings it's retail brands to the network, how they'd compete is an entirely different debate... it would make sense for BT heavily push Plusnet for the local angle.

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